.25 ACP Experiments

Jim Taylor
[subject]
Tuesday, July 22, 2025, 08:10 (368 days ago)

Ray .. who has been digging up old articles out of JD Jones's SIXGUNNER came up with one that I remembered but since it was 46 years ago I didn't remember everything perfectly. Almost. But not quite. I do remember it was fun! Here's the story behind it ..

Using a Raven .25 ACP - [image]

I am not sure why I was messing with a Raven. Probably the price had something to do with it because you could find them easily for less than $50 almost any place. I tried different ammo it. I tried the Winchester factory rounds that had a lead bullet hollow point with BB in the hollow point so they would feed. I fired them against a concrete block and they would not expand. I pulled the BB out of the nose, opened up the hollow point a bit and loaded them single shot. I shot some rabbits with them. They worked OK but were more trouble than a .22 Long Rifle and in reality, the .22 was better on rabbits.

Then I started experimenting with a cast 48 gr. truncated cone flat point. My Dad made the bullet mold for me. I did not size the bullets but shot them like they came from the mold. I lubed them with Lee Liquid Alox. The mold is long gone, I have no clue where or when.

1.7 gr. Unique Winchester Small Pistol primers - 976 fps
2.0 gr. Unique Winchester Small Pistol primers - 1061 fps
2.0 gr. Unique Federal #200 Small Rifle primers - 1090 fps (brass is ruined at each shot - the entire primer pocket is blown out) -- the velocity is approximate. In the article I wrote ".. near 1100 fps.." and I remember it was in the 1090's but I am not sure of the exact figure.

Pressures obviously were quite high but they never seemed to hurt the cheap little Raven. I shot it a lot and when I sold it or traded it or gave it away it was still working just fine.

I AM NOT RECOMMENDING THESE LOADS. IF YOU TRY THEM YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN. I AM JUST SHARING THIS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES AND FOR SOMETHING TO READ WHEN YOU ARE ON THE TOILET FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME FOR SOME REASON AND YOU NEED SOMETHING TO OCCUPY YOUR MIND.

I never did figure out where the primer and the pocket went. I am sure they were blown out during ejection since it is a blow-back gun, but I was never hit by anything and I never discovered where they went.  I figured they probably had been blown back with the slide and maybe bounced or were thrown forward when the slide stopped and started returning. ???

Silly little cartridge that continues to intrigue!

drdougrx
[subject]
Wednesday, July 23, 2025, 04:57 (367 days ago) @ Jim Taylor

Ray .. who has been digging up old articles out of JD Jones's SIXGUNNER came up with one that I remembered but since it was 46 years ago I didn't remember everything perfectly. Almost. But not quite. I do remember it was fun! Here's the story behind it ..

Using a Raven .25 ACP - [image]

I am not sure why I was messing with a Raven. Probably the price had something to do with it because you could find them easily for less than $50 almost any place. I tried different ammo it. I tried the Winchester factory rounds that had a lead bullet hollow point with BB in the hollow point so they would feed. I fired them against a concrete block and they would not expand. I pulled the BB out of the nose, opened up the hollow point a bit and loaded them single shot. I shot some rabbits with them. They worked OK but were more trouble than a .22 Long Rifle and in reality, the .22 was better on rabbits.

Then I started experimenting with a cast 48 gr. truncated cone flat point. My Dad made the bullet mold for me. I did not size the bullets but shot them like they came from the mold. I lubed them with Lee Liquid Alox. The mold is long gone, I have no clue where or when.

1.7 gr. Unique Winchester Small Pistol primers - 976 fps
2.0 gr. Unique Winchester Small Pistol primers - 1061 fps
2.0 gr. Unique Federal #200 Small Rifle primers - 1090 fps (brass is ruined at each shot - the entire primer pocket is blown out) -- the velocity is approximate. In the article I wrote ".. near 1100 fps.." and I remember it was in the 1090's but I am not sure of the exact figure.

Pressures obviously were quite high but they never seemed to hurt the cheap little Raven. I shot it a lot and when I sold it or traded it or gave it away it was still working just fine.

I AM NOT RECOMMENDING THESE LOADS. IF YOU TRY THEM YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN. I AM JUST SHARING THIS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES AND FOR SOMETHING TO READ WHEN YOU ARE ON THE TOILET FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME FOR SOME REASON AND YOU NEED SOMETHING TO OCCUPY YOUR MIND.

I never did figure out where the primer and the pocket went. I am sure they were blown out during ejection since it is a blow-back gun, but I was never hit by anything and I never discovered where they went.  I figured they probably had been blown back with the slide and maybe bounced or were thrown forward when the slide stopped and started returning. ???

I know of a guy in Alaska

Jim Taylor
[subject]
Wednesday, July 23, 2025, 06:23 (367 days ago) @ drdougrx

who ran a trap line for many years and who wanted something handy and cheap to do head shots to kill critters without doing significant damage to the hide. He tried several guns and loads. nothing worked great. He had a tip-up barrel Beretta 25 ACP but, on most critters, the factory 50-grain JRN load tended to just bounce off the skull and rip a long hole through the hide and managed thereby to only rile them up all the more and when that critter happened to be a wolverine it was not handy. So, he handloaded with enough RedDot to get 1000 fps. That combination worked 100% of the time. It punched through the skull, make a tiny hole in the hide, and killed instantly. He used it hundreds of times and sold it along with his traps to a friend when he left Alaska. Last he knew, the guy was still using the same load and gun and it was still like new.

I have a fantastic Astra 200 “Firecat” 6.35mm

WB
[subject]
Wednesday, July 23, 2025, 14:54 (367 days ago) @ drdougrx

It has only a groove along the top of the slide. Buy golly about anyone can keep it on a pie plate at 25 yds!

Their ideal range is barstool to barstool.

Jim Taylor
[subject]
Wednesday, July 23, 2025, 15:25 (367 days ago) @ WB

- No text -

I’ve got a beretta 950 jetfire. Bought it new in 1982.

drdougrx
[subject]
Thursday, July 24, 2025, 04:24 (366 days ago) @ WB

Really like it. 9 shot, tip up barrel.

That’s the SA model? I had a couple in .22 Short, Colt too

WB
[subject]
Thursday, July 24, 2025, 11:42 (366 days ago) @ drdougrx

I think the Colt was actually made in Italy by Astra. There is some connection there. I have chrono’d the 29gr. HP at 800-850 fps from them. Basically the same power as a good modern hi-power piston air rifle! Not that I’d want to get hit with one. Hardly a man stopper.

The .25 ACP has to be twice as powerful with that 50 gr. FMJ at the same speed.

Yep … single action. Like the gun a lot but

drdougrx
[subject]
Friday, July 25, 2025, 04:35 (365 days ago) @ WB

my LCP 2 has pushed it off the preferred list!

.25 acp

Baxter6551
[subject]
Saturday, July 26, 2025, 04:32 (364 days ago) @ drdougrx

I had a Beretta .22 short for a backup gun as a young cop. Larry Seecamp wanted me to carry one of his .25s he had recently started making. But I couldn’t afford one so he traded me for the Beretta. Had my name as the serial number. I bought one for my wife for her 25th birthday also personalized, polished and tuned by Larry’s Dad. Later got a .32 Seecamp which assumed backup role. [image]. I have never needed to shoot anything with them, but as others have noted would not want to get shot by a .25 or anything for that matter.

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